tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post4107512812660290500..comments2023-10-23T09:23:22.051-04:00Comments on Your Schools: CMS Teach For America studyUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger58125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-91404911092764503052010-08-04T15:29:33.283-04:002010-08-04T15:29:33.283-04:00...saying so long suckas!...saying so long suckas!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-25718046544752331292010-08-04T08:08:21.520-04:002010-08-04T08:08:21.520-04:00TFA's have a place but they all aren't eff...TFA's have a place but they all aren't effective teachers. What they do have that non-TFA's don't is continuous support and training during the summer months and throughout the year from TFA and CMS. CMS had a similiar program for new hires from 4year colleges. It was a mentoring program run by the CMS Professional Development Dept. Principals gave this program high marks and accolades. It was extremely successful, but it wasn't created by Gorman. It was in place before he arrived so what did he do shortly thereafter called all of those who worked in the program to a meeting and told them the mentoring program would close in a few weeks.(A foreshadowing of the RIFT program now in place.) So now college trained 1st and 2nd year teachers have no systematic on-going training and support like TFA's. In addition to the ongoing support they recieve from the TFA organization, TFA's in effect get a "double dose" of support, training and mentoring from each school's in house professional development programs.<br /> As for the "Aspiring Leaders Program" why wasn't it open to all 1st or 2nd year teachers? At least they should've have been allowd to apply. I personally know of 1 "Aspiring Leader" who had low test scores, I mean low, less than 45% passing rate, but because of her gift of gab and good interview skills learned as a result of the TFA's college experience in a Sociological field, this TFA is shadowing, rubbing elbows with Gorman, Ann Clark and Zone Supertindents. <br /> The bottom line is that TFA's like all 1st and 2nd year teachers have some highly effective ones, some with the right mentoring and support that can become highly effective and others who shouldn't be in the profession at all.<br /> Gorman and Ann Clark need to quit skewing data and studies so they get the BOE to continue to rubber stamp his programs without throughly studying them. The BOE needs to get a brain...how can Gorman and Clark still have jobs and not have been victims of "Strategic Staffing" when the district's rating has been below proficiency on State exams for at least the past two-three years and just reached the Proficient level this year? It's all about how you spin the data isn't it! Last note Dr. Gorman is a master PR person and I believe he's padding his resume on the backs of all CMS children? If not he'd give all schools freedom and flexibility and all 1st and 2nd year teachers the same opportunities TFA's by allowing them to apply for the Aspiring Leader's program and establishing a parallell mentoring support program for them. Then he'd be comparing apples to apples. But nothing will change it'll be business as usual and he'll ride off into the sunset to a more prestigious and higher paying job without looking back and leaving CMS in the proverbial mess!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-6907738149460436492010-08-02T18:37:21.971-04:002010-08-02T18:37:21.971-04:004:27, please, give it a break.
How about this, ...4:27, please, give it a break. <br /><br />How about this, ask any TFA teacher who has supported them throughout the school year AND ask them how their year would have been without that support.<br /><br />When you find the answers to those questions, post again.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-65718131405194298922010-08-02T16:27:18.924-04:002010-08-02T16:27:18.924-04:00It sounds like the majority of people posting here...It sounds like the majority of people posting here have no direct experience with either TFA or classroom teaching. I taught in CMS for as a traditionally certified social studies teacher and my husband taught in Nash County as a TFA teacher. I chose the traditional route over TFA because I beleived that ed. classes would better prepare me. What a crock. Nothing prepares you for teaching other than being in a classroom. All first year teachers have a hard time no matter what kind of training they got. TFA teachers go through an intense 6 week summer program where they actually TEACH students---which is much more than I can say I was allowed to do during my student teaching at East Forsyth High School. My husband, as a TFA teacher, coached both baseball AND Soccer and was part of lots of school committees, just like all the other teachers. TFA teachers DO NOT get hand picked classrooms. Where did you get that information??? While we may not currently have a teaching shortage, we do have a shortage of teachers who are willing to teach in our most troubled schools, which is exactly where TFA teachers are sent. I happily took my cushy role at one of the "good" CMS schools and as a product of a traditional teacher ed. program I can honestly say that I was terribly ill prepared. I improved, but only with the help of other teachers and good administrators. TFA is not the culprit here...Find a TFA person and talk to them about education. Then find a non TFA teacher who has been in CMS for any amount of time and you tell me which one you would rather have teaching your child.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-53444701178471233372010-08-02T15:23:28.949-04:002010-08-02T15:23:28.949-04:00It is not an "achievement gap". It is a...It is not an "achievement gap". It is a "parenting gap".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-87220495240044508562010-08-02T12:53:10.827-04:002010-08-02T12:53:10.827-04:00A few questions come to mind:
Are the TFA's...A few questions come to mind: <br /><br />Are the TFA's highly qualified; i.e., have they passed the PRAXIS II? If so, when does that have to happen--if not, why? <br /><br />How many principals/administrators at the school level actually have substantial classroom experience that qualifies them to evaluate teachers? <br /><br />Why do people assume that teaching at the college level gives one the necessary experience to teach at all other levels without any specialized training? College students and kindergarteners are very different. Would you want your OBGYN performing a knee replacement?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-7953145349333581362010-08-02T11:40:35.466-04:002010-08-02T11:40:35.466-04:00"Camp"
They've been "planning&..."Camp"<br /><br />They've been "planning" that in some form or another for decades.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-57842584347293942562010-08-02T10:53:44.502-04:002010-08-02T10:53:44.502-04:00Re audition process: CMS is gearing up to do a &qu...Re audition process: CMS is gearing up to do a "teacher camp," in which applicants must do some actual teaching in front of judges, who will screen for folks with classroom skills. Not sure when that will start, but I'm pretty sure it'll be as controversial as everything else related to teacher hiring.Ann Doss Helmshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03511764376105157616noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-7383870208746634442010-08-02T10:37:47.433-04:002010-08-02T10:37:47.433-04:00Did I mention the Educational Psychology class I w...Did I mention the Educational Psychology class I was required to take as a lateral-entry teacher in order to become "certified" to teach my subject area at the high school level after 4.5 years of graduate TA and assistant professor teaching experience? <br /><br />When someone can explain to me the relevance of salivating Pavlovian dog experiments and their correlation to teaching teenagers in an inner-city public school environment, do let me know. <br /><br />How many college professors in teacher education programs are licensed to teach? How many have actually taught in a variety of suburban and urban school settings in different states over a sufficient period of time? How many regularly visit public schools to evaluate their own graduates in real life classroom situations? In other words, how many universities research their own effectiveness in preparing teachers to teach? Why doesn't the U.S. have national licensing standards? Why do some states have reciprocity licensing agreements and others don't? I don't know the answers to these questions.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-67855517397245358322010-08-02T09:47:51.570-04:002010-08-02T09:47:51.570-04:00Why did I have to go to school to get my teaching ...Why did I have to go to school to get my teaching license when CMS keeps bringing in more and more unlicensed teachers. That's fine during a teacher shortage, but we are no longer having a teacher shortage. If doctors need a license to practice medicine, and lawyers need a license to practice law, shouldn't all teachers need a teaching license to teach? If not, why does the state even issue them?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-57637212707097227362010-08-02T09:18:16.846-04:002010-08-02T09:18:16.846-04:00As a former graduate school TA at the most expensi...As a former graduate school TA at the most expensive university in the country (as of today), I can assure you my @ass would have been gr@ss if the classes I taught were not up to par. I was only allowed to teach non-major undergraduate classes but many students in the classes I taught had prior experience in my subject area and were required to evaluate me at the end of each semester. I also worked directly and indirectly with the department chair and professors who also regularly evaluated me. In addition, I had to teach 3 college level classes in front of a panel of professors before I was awarded a graduate teaching assistantship. Basically, part of an audition process for the job which is why I'm always amazed a principal would hire ANY teacher without seeing how they can handle themselves in front of a classroom before allowing them to sign a contract. Recommendations matter, but being a good student doesn't always translate into being a good teacher. Two separate "skill sets" (I hate this term) are required to be an effective teacher. I've seen Ivy League graduates who couldn't effectively teach their way out of a 2nd grade math class. <br /><br />The person who asked why CMS and other school systems aren't recruiting TA's as lateral entry teachers in addition to TFA teachers makes an interesting point. Although, as I stated in a previous post, nothing really prepares a person to work in an inner city high school with serious problems no matter how experienced they are in a different setting or how high they score on a standardized test. The only way to navigate this beast is battle field boot camp field experience, Rambo-on-a-mission type determination combined with some level of good veteran teacher and principal support - if you're lucky. <br /><br />Had I chosen to stay in the public school teaching profession, I would have eventually applied to a better school system in a different county taking my misspelled educator award, experience and good evaluations with me. This is not to imply I was a perfect teacher by any stretch of the imagination. There is no such thing as a perfect teacher. Being a teacher is an evolutionary process which is why I despise tenure in public schools and at the college level. Tenure allows teachers/professors to burn out and coast if they choose. The private sector does not operate in this fashion. You sink or swim based on yearly evaluations and merit. <br /><br />People are free to attack Dr. Gorman but we ALL know incompetent teachers exist at every school regardless of it's socioeconomic makeup. While in CMS, my children had many outstanding teachers along with a few horrible teachers. The same holds true where they are now - at an expensive private school. The only difference between the two is private school parents will put enormous pressure on school administrators to remove teachers who are not meeting their high expectations. This is called cultural "entitlement" described favorably as it pertains to education and student achievement in the book Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell. Tuition money talks or donors walk.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-21235911349973207382010-08-02T09:10:55.382-04:002010-08-02T09:10:55.382-04:00Ann,
Thanks for doing this article. Since this i...Ann,<br /><br />Thanks for doing this article. Since this is an anonymous forum, you would have no idea of my education and training, so the short of it is that besides living, teaching and attending school in several countries on multiple continents, I also have a doctorate of which 50% of my studies was devoted to research and statistics, so with that in mind, I have numerous reservations regarding this study. Here they are and some I’m sure are repeats of other posts:<br /><br />1) This study was done by CMS, for CMS about people employed by CMS, with data given and collected by CMS. That fact alone makes me doubt the viability and accuracy of the study from the beginning. (Center for Research & Evaluation, Office of Accountability, Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools)<br />2) The executive summary states that this study is the first of two annual reports for Charlotte-Mecklenburg Schools on the local Teach For America (TFA) program. This study was in 2008. This is 2010. The key word here is annual.<br />3) Words such as “Significant, positive effects”, “No/Non-significant differences”, “collapsed into a single outcome to account for small sample sizes”, are all ways to obfuscate with statistics. Significant to what degree? 10% error? 5% error 1% error? 1 Standard deviation? Nothing spectacular in those figures.<br />4) “Although some CMS principals participating in this study expressed dissatisfaction”… Of course they aren’t going to say anything negative that can go back on them. Do you truly think that Dr. Gorman/or his cabinet didn’t know or handpick these principals? A blind survey developed by non-partisan observers and researchers should have been used if this study was something more than an attempt at fluffing the bull manure.<br />5) “only courses (at the high school level) with required End-Of-Course (EOC) tests were retained for analysis.” That isn’t a great deal of data. And something similar for middle school but so convoluted that I even had a hard time figuring out how they say they collected data.<br />6) Why only 8 principals? Why only 16 TFAs? Are there only 16 TFAs that teach the above courses? Why such a small sample size? It wasn’t necessary to do them all, but hey, it isn’t like they are hard to find. 25 to 30 of each would have been a good number.<br />7) And finally, since the results were less than stellar, why in the world would Dr. Gorman use it as a selling point to keep TFAs?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-37451315457323106382010-08-02T08:04:30.696-04:002010-08-02T08:04:30.696-04:00An additional question that needs to be addressed ...An additional question that needs to be addressed is, "What does Pay for Performance measure--whether students make a year's growth or whether they are all on grade level at the end of the year?" There is a huge difference. A student who begins a year or more behind has much more to accomplish than those who begin on grade level. How do you hold teachers accountable for factors outside their classroom? <br /><br />Also, to coment on another point, lateral entry teachers are only in middle and high schools. It's my understanding that you can no longer do lateral entry in elementary school.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-58518508632383840422010-08-02T00:45:45.592-04:002010-08-02T00:45:45.592-04:00I have never commented before, but I have some com...I have never commented before, but I have some comments, questions, and thoughts that I wish someone could answer...<br /><br />..with the improved accountability department (much due to performance based pay) can we do a more conclusive (and more representative) study after this past school year? <br /><br />... comparing apples to apples: what is the TFA success rate versus other lateral entry teachers in CMS? Within the same school? In my experience with a school that has placed TFA teachers almost every year since 2004, the majority of other first year teachers were lateral entry (we rarely, if ever had "traditionally trained" teachers) <br /><br />... What is the national TFA rate for teachers remaining in the classroom past their two years? Is Charlotte above or below?<br /><br />... What's the CMS retention rate for traditionally trained teachers past two years? past five? How does it compare to the national retention rate? How does it compare to TFA teachers in Charlotte? <br /><br />... with teachers being laid off, how many are let go due to sub-standard performance? How many are let go due to lack of seniority? What are the differences between schools that place TFA versus non-TFA placing schools? How many are lateral entry versus traditionally trained? <br /><br /><br />... let's really look at the reason TFA places in Charlotte: the achievement gap. No achievement gap means TFA doesn't need to be here. Has the gap between those that "have" vs. "have not" closed at all since 2004? With the gaps that exist even within schools, whether it is a TFA or non-TFA teacher, what is CMS doing to really look to make sure that ALL students are achieving? <br /><br />... with the amount of people on here with many intelligent (yet conflicting) things to say, how can we all start being a part of the difference, instead of putting the blame or waiting for someone else? (i.e. start volunteering in schools outside our neighborhoods)<br /><br /><br />I don't think there is a definitive side to the issue, but I sure do appreciate all the thoughtful dialogue!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-59837495598396578562010-08-01T23:36:19.240-04:002010-08-01T23:36:19.240-04:00Anon 11:16, it's clear that Gorman has no inte...Anon 11:16, it's clear that Gorman has no intentions in helping CMS teachers, TAs or students. <br /><br />He is drunk with the wine of egotism and pride. I hope he remembers that pride comes before the fall.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-59777102905714136112010-08-01T23:16:28.082-04:002010-08-01T23:16:28.082-04:00I've been a CMS teacher assistant for 10+ year...I've been a CMS teacher assistant for 10+ years and an elementary ed student. Can't help but wonder--if I have to take rigorous education classes and complete clinicals for every methods class, then why don't TFAs? There's no way they can learn everything they need to know to be successful and competent in a classroom in six weeks. <br /><br />I'd also like to know why CMS takes no apparent interest in working with TAs who are in college or want to enroll to become licensed teachers. TAs have invaluable on-the-job training, which puts them at an advantage over the TFAs. Making an effort to "grow their own" teachers would be a win-win situation both academically and financially for CMS.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-48964992308742491322010-08-01T11:01:57.226-04:002010-08-01T11:01:57.226-04:00Ann:
Great work on the TFA story, but the next th...Ann:<br /><br />Great work on the TFA story, but the next thing you need to look at is Pay For Performance, the centerpiece of Gorman's 'reform' efforts. The vast majority of the research shows this does not work, yet Gorman continues to move forward. Why? Just look to his quotes from your story.<br /><br />"A CMS study found mixed results when TFA cadets were compared with other teachers. Superintendent Peter Gorman says he remains convinced the program is part of a smart recruitment plan.<br /><br />"We are pleased to have them with us," he said last week."<br /><br />Not reality-based, but clearly seems to be from someone who wants to be Washington-based.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-67802119479895597122010-08-01T09:51:34.342-04:002010-08-01T09:51:34.342-04:00Gorman loves to transfer principals to other schoo...Gorman loves to transfer principals to other schools. How lame. If a principal is successful at a school, that principal should be encouraged to stay there, not transfer to another school. Instead of the weekly/monthly/semi-annual/yearly chess game of transferring principals, find others to take on the new challenges. I resent the upheaval a change in a successful principal brings to a school. Our school had a change in leadership and now we are struggling.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-56548045941243207572010-08-01T09:43:18.137-04:002010-08-01T09:43:18.137-04:00Didn't Gorman state a Master's degree mean...Didn't Gorman state a Master's degree meant very little? Did he also mean earning a Doctorate means very little in leading a school system? TFA is a cheaper way to place warm bodies into a classroom; nothing more, nothing less. Several years ago, we had two TFA's at our school. They were ineffective teachers. Their classrooms scored the lowest on the EOGs. But, that doesn't matter. TFA's save the system money so Gorman can hire more executive staff members. No wonder people have such a low opinion of teachers when Gorman has the same opinion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-83191039283373831432010-08-01T02:02:55.043-04:002010-08-01T02:02:55.043-04:00Veteran teachers would make better use of their ti...Veteran teachers would make better use of their time coaching education majors who plan to stay in the profession rather than wasting their precious time on itinerant workers.<br /><br />Low performing schools need faculty stability more than any other schools. By placing TFAs in these schools undermine a faculty's ability to bond, build professional relationships, collaborate and create a coherent, fluent and strong academic program. Having a revolving door of employees like Wal-Mart is no way to educate children (if that's the intent).<br /><br />Clearly, Gorman has not thought this through. I am trying to figure out whether he thinks using contract workers is a cost-saving measure or if he's just that incompetent and short-sighted.<br /><br />If CMS had not signed a contract with TFA guaranteeing them a certain number of slots, there would be more jobs available for teachers. So yes, TFA IS part of the blame for CMS's teacher layoffs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-78206215827494656122010-07-31T23:46:24.879-04:002010-07-31T23:46:24.879-04:00I find it interesting all of the people who read o...I find it interesting all of the people who read one report and feel that they understand everything about TFA and CMS. First, TFA does not pay for all loans. It does not cancel everything out. In fact, TFA teachers are required to attend so many hours of extra professional development in order to be eligible for an educational grant. They are then granted around 4,500 a year by AmeriCorps, not the school system. In addition, TFA teachers are required to attend graudate school classes while serving. This has been paid for in the past, (just like CMS paid for all teacher's higher education) but this is not the case anymore. Therefore, TFA teachers are now having to use that education grant money to pay for graduate school.<br /><br />Overall, there is going to be good and bad with TFA teachers, like all teachers. Straight out of college, there are effective and ineffective teachers, no matter how they become teachers. However, you cannot blame these young professionals for the layoffs.<br /><br />When someone signs on to be TFA, he/she does not know about the layoffs in the area. He/she is simply assigned to a region and come to the region to do a job in which he/she is hired to do. In CMS's case, it is unfortunate that so many teachers had to lose their jobs, but TFA is not the reason.<br /><br />Finally, working with TFA teachers, I can tell you from experience that students don't know that these teachers are TFA, new teachers, or anything of the like. So those who feel that the students know where the teacher comes from, you are incorrect. At my school (which is not 8-year olds, but high school) the TFA teachers are loved, respected, and are seen as teachers like the rest of us. In my experience the teachers do not gain knowledge from veteran teachers then think they know everything. Rather, they continue to learn in order to be more effective in the classroom.<br /><br />I'd like for everyone to ask themselves, why would a recent graduate sign on to go to the inner city in order to boost a resume or receive enough money to pay for a graduate degree in education? It makes more sense to me that someone would join an organization like TFA in order to make a difference.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-3167626882771982562010-07-31T23:25:24.292-04:002010-07-31T23:25:24.292-04:00I am surprised by the amount of misinformation bei...I am surprised by the amount of misinformation being included in comments. Just to clarify a few points, CMS does not pay for student loans for TFA teachers. Even if they did, there are plenty of alternative methods for paying back these loans a lot faster. For example, a higher paying job outside of education. TFA teachers do receive nearly $5,000 a year from Americorp funding. That is funding that comes from the federal government and has nothing to do with CMS. Also, TFA teachers are not assigned on grade level classes or easier classes by any means. That is clearly a piece of misinformation or a generalization. Either of which is inaccurate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-90093387705819433922010-07-31T21:10:32.482-04:002010-07-31T21:10:32.482-04:00For the studentwith a major in Education who wonde...For the studentwith a major in Education who wonders if CMS will pay for her loans. Only if you are willing to give Gorman a big chunk of it. It's all about the money through short term cheap labor.<br /><br />Take your talents to another place.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-13534612692067934512010-07-31T20:40:34.855-04:002010-07-31T20:40:34.855-04:00Sorry for the double post. Obviously this system ...Sorry for the double post. Obviously this system has its own issues. Ann, please feel free to delete one of the duplicates and this post.EyeInsideCMShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03596908588700829347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4020455191286536580.post-36147949943545430602010-07-31T20:38:31.514-04:002010-07-31T20:38:31.514-04:00TFAs are not the problem. The TFA program was cre...TFAs are not the problem. The TFA program was created to help in areas where there are teacher shortages. CMS doesn't have a teacher shortage.<br />Don't hate the TFAs just because they have been given a way to pay off their student loans. I have supervised many fine TFAs and a few who were absolutely not fine. Who in their right mind would turn down thousands of dollars. Yes, they move on. That is the nature of civil service.<br /><br />What should be done with the TFA study is to use all of the strategies and lessons learned to help ALL teachers get better. But that would make too much sense.<br /><br />CMS does have a superintendent who is doing everything he can to feather his political ambitions and has repeatedly said so.<br /><br />It is time to stop blaming the teachers, harassing, humiliating, berating and terrorizing them--administration are you listening? parents are you listening?<br /><br />It is time to hold the parents and the children responsible for their own behavior and learning. Stop enabling and entitling them.<br /><br />If the issue is teacher preparation, then hold the universities liable and change the teacher preparation program.<br /><br />If "lifers" are failing to show relevance and rigor to students, help them to do so. But I guarantee that if you maintain the expectation of discipline (administration and central office and PARENTS) and are consistent with it—stop making excuses for them and enabling them, then all teachers will be more effective, all students will learn more and there will be less of a need for TSAs.EyeInsideCMShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03596908588700829347noreply@blogger.com