Interim Superintendent Hugh Hattabaugh says he'll pitch about half a dozen more "asks," or increased spending that requires extra county money, to the school board in the coming weeks. But the $25 million to $30 million he's seeking to give all employees a 3 percent raise is by far the big-ticket item.
Mecklenburg County commissioners' Chair Harold Cogdell said Wednesday it's too early to comment on the likelihood of CMS getting that sum. It's big, he said, but he understands the need.
The county, which has about 4,200 people on its payroll, budgeted $10 million in the current year to give merit raises averaging 3 percent, Cogdell said.
CMS, which employs about 18,000, hasn't had money for widespread raises since 2008-09 (individuals who changed duties or took part in merit-pay pilots have gotten bumps). Hattabaugh and his staff are trying to convince the community that an across-the-board raise is overdue. See the video created by CMS staff here, and read the CMS budget presentation, which includes the case for raises starting on page 36, here.
Before the recession, CMS followed the lead of state legislators, who cover a big chunk of the CMS payroll. If the state gave, say , a 3 percent raise to teachers and others who are state employees, CMS would match that for county-paid workers.
But with no money for raises in the state's 2012-13 plan (approved last year as part of a two-year budget), CMS hopes county commissioners will agree to pick up the part that would normally come from the state -- about 71 percent of the $25 million-plus, the CMS budget office calculated Wednesday. And that additional supplement to state-paid workers would become an ongoing annual expense from the county budget.
Cogdell says he's keeping an open mind, but he wishes CMS had led with plans for cost savings and creative efficiencies. "When the first thing you do is asking for more," he said, " it does create some level of skepticism."
Thursday, January 12, 2012
More about CMS raises
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Harold is very aware of levels of skepticism, like when an elected official pushes for a huge change in funding for a group that, soon afterwards, offers him a job, which he accepts.
CMS has plenty of areas of low/no return program expenditures to cull out $100 to $150 million in redirecting money for whatever new idea they want to pursue. Even to the point of giving it back to the taxpayers.
Teachers and staff of CMS not only have not gotten a raise in four years; but their salaries have gone down. This is because the state has increased the amount employees must pay for medical insurance out of pocket. Morale and performance at CMS will go down even further if teachers and staff are not given a raise this year.
How about a raise for the part-time teachers at CPCC? The students who receive unemployment benefits make more than we do.
Teaching is certainly a very important job in our society. So, this is an important issue for us to consider. Yet, I'd prefer CMS to find the funding themselves, from within their current funding, rather than asking the tax payers to foot this bill.
As, 8:37 states, there's plenty of low/no return programs whose funding may be better utilized for teacher raises.
This phenomenom of asking for more and more money from those who pay taxex must stop, if our local, state and federal governmnet institutions are to ever regain credibility.
Yooo hooooo!...over here!!!....
Cut Bright Beginnings, get $11 million from the County (total program is $22 mllion per year so more could be saved).... demand our $7 million back from the Whitewater Center and all of a sudden you have $18 million of the $25 million.
Voila!
The recent actions of the new school board leadership hardly seems like a productive way to encourage suburban support for more school spending. Why provide more money to a system that does not value its suburban students?
Years of suburban bashing (while ignoring spending disparities) on the part of some civic leaders, the press, and local activists appears to becoming home to roost.
CMS employees are already overpaid relative to their private-sector peers. The proof is in the "teacher retention rate." CMS's teacher retention rate is the highest it's been in the past two decades. If teachers thought they were underpaid, they'd leave their jobs and find better employment elsewhere. But they're not doing that.
10:04, Chief HR Officer Daniel Habrat told the board that voluntary departures, including those for higher-paying jobs, are on the rise and will continue to increase as the economy improves. I've added a link to the full presentation, which includes the data they're using to talk about raises. Attrition stats are on p. 43.
@ 10:04 - Teacher retention rates are high due the the economic climate. Not because they are overpaid. If there were an abundance of jobs available, I'm sure teachers would leave in record numbers. Your statistic is not only true for CMS, but many school systems across the country. Take a look.
3 consecutive years of layoffs have teachers feeling lucky to have jobs. Every year we are asking teachers to do more for less money, with less supplies, and worse, less support.
In case our society has forgotten, education is the backbone of our nation. Everyone is worried about a couple of extra dollars leaving their pockets while students across the country are left to struggle. Does CMS have more to cut? Possibly. Keep in mind, the school system has been cutting repeatedly for 3 years while receiving more students and incurring higher cost. You can only trim so much fat before you start to take away from the meat.
I agree that CMS needs to find the money in the existing budget. One way to save millions is cut down on the number of buses rolling on the roads. The bus ridership numbers, especially for high school students, are completely inaccurate, based on eligible riders not actual riders. Cut the fleet by 1/4 and save $15 million a year.
Will we ever find a leader in Mecklenburg that says,"Let's cut some of our costs"?
They cut out busses at the beginning of this year. They added an additional 45 minutes to the elementary school day which allowed the busses to sync up their schedules. However, That plan failed. Elementary children were arriving home after 6 pm in some areas (FROM THE BUS!). Please, before we post more non-sense on the various ways CMS can save money, please take the time to perform some research.
Next option... Busses are out. Great idea 10:36!
10:31 I agree that education is the backbone of this country. However to dismiss people's concerns about "a few extra dollars" is rather arrogant. Those "few extra dollars" have been increasing every year, especially this year with the county-wide re-evaluation. If citizens had proof that all government monies were being spent wisely and showing positive results they might be more inclined to support those "few extra dollars". But, then again, if the government had been spending wisely perhaps there wouldn't be a need for our "few extra dollars" in the first place.
10:48 - So your argument is: We are going to stick it to the teachers and the children of the county because we don't trust how our local government is spending money? No raises for 4 years, deep cuts for 3 years. Yes, they NEED more money. Yes, cost around the county have gone up. No, It's not arrogant to call it a "few extra bucks" considering who the money will be aiding.
Folks, remember now that this was the first year that the proposed budget for CMS was to be cut. CMS's budget has gone up every year till now.
Ann, please try to find out what was the final total on CMS's budget. The county upped its contribution because they thought the state would cut. However the state did not cut and actually upped a little if I recall correctly.
On top of that, the feds upped the FRL income levels so more kids were going to fall into that category fraudulently or not.
CMS lied to us when it presented its budget last year, telling the county it would have to cut many teacher positions. Why would anyone believe anything CMS says relative to its budget. It suffered no consequences las year relative to its bald face lie. If the county grants its request for additional money this yesr after fraudulently revaluing thousands of homes in Meck, then, please, voters, remember this when the CC's are up for reelection. If we send this bunch back to office, it says that you can do anything you want to the taxpayers and we will just lay down and take it.
CMS is not able to make positive change in this community. It received an extra $20 million from the state after it basically demanded that same money from the county and refused to give the money back to the county when that money was given to them from the state....that was my property tax increase of $1500 (Yes I am a South Charlotte resident) Jennifer Roberts. That alone would be the majority of the money CMS is requesting, but I'm sure that money has been long spent on some knew ineffective high-poverty student programming.
As far as teacher raises - Teachers behave like professionals! I watched a news article on TV last night and the teacher they interviewed "needing" his raise was sloppily dressed and had speech I would expect out of an teenager, slurring and mispronouncing words. In his words, "I would like the raise because I had to get rid of ONE of my cars already and I would like to be able to take an extra vacation here and there"....with all of the people out of work right now, and teachers needing raises to "make it", I'm not sure that person was the best representative for you. Many of out here work hard, share single car and do not take vacations. Oh and we dress professionally on the job and sound like we have an education.
11:03 - One Word: Inflation.
Maybe I'll go to the store later and buy a coke for a nickel. But you're right, we keep giving them more money (or as any sensible person would see it. Less than what they need).
We're not talking about the NASCAR hall of fame, the light rail, Time Warner arena, and etc. We are talking about teachers. We are talking about education. Have we really become this jaded by the recession that we can no longer recognize what is truly important?
Total for 2011-12: $1.17 billion, including $662.3 mil from state, $328.3 mil from county, $160.5 mil from "federal and other grants" and $18.3 mil from "other and special revenue.
Total for 2010-11: $1.15 billion, including $634.7 mil from state, $302.3 mil from county, $185.9 mil from fed/grants and $27.3 mil from other.
CMS has got a lot of archived budget info at http://www.cms.k12.nc.us/mediaroom/budget/Pages/default.aspx
Dear 10:47am, I actually know quite a bit about CMS transportation issues, and the budget. By your comments, you are clearly unaware of how CMS transportation routes work and how they are funded. There are changes made every year in order to save $ here and there. The plan did not fail because they are not reducing the elem school day next year but will tweek some bell schedules. Apparently you are mad that your child arrives home everyday at 6pm from a Magnet school. You have the option to pick your child up at 4:15pm like many other parents do to avoid delays.
Yes the money has to come from somewhere. After reading these posts, I would rather have it come out of the transportation budget than the teacher/classroom budget. Can't have it all people!
11:15 - Possibly you should have received a better education. I would hope that you experienced a lesson in stereotyping and not generalizing of a group of people based upon the actions of one.
I'm glad you've worked hard for your money. I'd hate for you to pay your taxes based upon the value of the home. You definitely need more money to purhcase those professional clothes. Who cares about the high poverty children?
11:19, My child arrived home after 5. I live less than 6 miles from our school. It's a neighborhood school.
Clearly, you consider yourself to be an authority on the bus schedules (you're wrong...). Please enlighten the board exactly how we are going to save millions and still run an effective bus system by cutting the number of busses.
Also, the number of busses were increased as a result of the times students were getting home. Coincidentally, back to the numbers they were at before they extended the school day. What we accomplished was no decrease in busses, a longer school day for young children, and scheduling nightmares for some families.
Thanks Ann.
So there you go folks. CMS had a budget increase of around $20 million last year. It has not had a budget decrease since forever.
But as one put it, teachers net take home pay has gone due to health insurance and retirement contribution like most of us in the private sector have seen. Many in the private sector have even lost employer contribution if they did not lose retirement programs altogether.
So teachers, while I have always felt you are underpaid for your value to society, most of the private sector have had no raises either, lost some take home pay, or even lost their job. But once again, your are the tailend. Educrats and politicans have used you and have nearly handcuffed you in the classroom to the point it is almost a miracle you can effectively teach many of these students who need it so much.
10:52--The argument is not that we're going to "stick it to the teachers and the children" because we can't trust the county government. The argument is that the taxpayers have to be assured that our money (remember, it is our money) is being and will be used wisely before we consent to further taxation--does not seem to be unreasonable to me. How many times can taxes and budgets inch up and inch up before it's too much without some real accountability?
I realize that teachers are suffering due to the economy. But so are many others outside the public sector.
Anonymous at 11:03,
Many of us have become jaded by CMS, and the only bearing the recession has on the issue is that a lot of people in the private sector have seen cuts to actual their salaries and benefits. The group that always seem to go unscathed is that which is supposed to be working for the rest of us--government employees. As for CMS, it promises and promises, but often does not deliver. And, if you read Kristof's column yesterday, it may be impossible for it to deliver on many of its goals no matter the budget. CMS must prioritize; it can find the money for raises if it wishes by cutting some of its sacred cows that provide low return. That is what the private sector has done.
11:48 I like your post. Sadly, too many families are taking a beating in the current economy.
What's currently taking place is typical with any public service entity when their budgets get tight. Cut what the tax payer can see, so they'll agree to higher taxes. We can't live without police, fire fighters, and teachers. Losing back office personnel doesn't create the same reaction!
11:31, Strike a nerve?
So the concern is, that good personnel will leave?
Why not find those few, hundred or so, and give them a raise, the majority, which is left, is are doing a miserable job.
Save $3-4 million immediately. Disband the CMS police force and outsource to CMPD and Sheriff.
Or are they still providing St. Pete with armed escort services?
Or for that matter stopping Larry from using certain areas in the Government Center??
hey 12:04, you are either really funny or really PO'd about something. Good luck to you.
12:04, you hit the nail on the head. And, it has forever been thus. Recent examples other than CMS teachers? How about closing library branches, cutting parks and recreation drastically--two of the few county services the average property tax payer actually uses.
Saying that teachers haven't had a raise in four years is disingenuous. Every year teachers are bumped up to the next pay step, meaning that they make more money than they did the previous school year. That may not be a "raise," but it is most certainly NOT income stagnation.
1:20, it hasn't worked that way. The state adjusted the pay scale so they did NOT get those yearly increases. For instance, the pay level for a fourth-year teacher became the next year's pay level for a fifth-year teacher, and so forth. So they're credited for the right number of years, but they're making the same as they were in 2008-09 (plus paying a bigger share of benefits).
I've said it once and will say it again. There is no one in the CMS system that deserves a raise of any type.
This is a failing system. The entire US school system is a failing system. Filled with cheating teachers and students, illiterate instructors, lazy union loafers, and in general everyone who wants to get paid like a white collar exec and loaf like a garbage man.
No raises. No bonuses. In fact there should be wholesale firings and school closings. This should be privatized and people given the choice of where to go.
This is nothing more than a government mob running a racket in the form of a school system.
A complete and total joke.
Anonymous said...
Teachers and staff of CMS not only have not gotten a raise in four years; but their salaries have gone down. This is because the state has increased the amount employees must pay for medical insurance out of pocket. Morale and performance at CMS will go down even further if teachers and staff are not given a raise this year.
January 12, 2012 8:49 AM
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Many in private sector have gotten pay cuts as well and have to pay for their health insurance. So why should those tax payers pay for public employees (teachers or anyother public employee) to have better benefits than they do in the private sector?
Public employees are a group of congenital whiners. They do nothing, take the easiest path in college, loaf around the classroom, and then hide behind the skirts of a union made up of thugs.
Public employees are the reason we are in this fix. They have no concept of budgeting and no work ethic. This is just a jobs program for the stupid and otherwise unemployable.
1:57 really? public employees are the reason we are in a recession? I thought it was the greedy private sector buffoons...you konw, the ones who tell use how wonderful they are at running their businesses...
Ann, are you saying that an 8th year teacher today is making the exact same base salary as he or she was making four years ago as a 4th year teacher? Is that right?
1:57 makes one point that cannot be ignored - public sector employees and their unions (where they exist) are driving local, state and federal government budget shortfalls. This is due to the unfunded obligations assocaited with their retirement plans, the smaller contributions they make to their healthcare plans, and the confusing budgeting process that challenges even people who follow this closely to understand.
please pardon my horrid spelling...
I own a small business, provide health insurance to my employees and have been hammered by health insurance premium increases. Two years ago we were faced with a 40% rate increase, which forced us to switch from a PPO plan to an HSA plan. Now we have annual deductibles of $5,000 and $10,000 for individuals and families, respectively. My family now receives no medical cost reimbursement until we hit our $10,000 annual deductible. Last year our premiums increased 12.5% in the HSA plan thanks to Obamacare, thanks to it's additional mandated coverage items that do not apply to anyone in our company. Oh, and my family still receives no medical cost reimbursement until we hit our deductible. So, our premiums went up, but we receive nothing more than we were the previous year for the rate increase.
So, although I appreciate the job the teachers are doing for our children, I cannot support any increase in their pay and or benefits that requires in increase in our taxes.
2:29, the way I calculate it, the person who was a fourth-year teacher in 2008-09, the last year they got raises, is now a seventh-year teacher in 2011-12. And yes, that teacher would have seen no increase in base pay. The question is whether he/she will get a bump going into eighth year next year.
In all this discussion, you can not ignore the fact that of the 1600 CMS graduates that applied to CPCC last fall semester/quarter, 1200 required remedial courses for no college credit at their own expense.
Seems like CMS shoould give up some money to CPCC.
I would submit that you can not totally attribute this to CMS teachers but rather the system (its ridiculous rules, policies, and total lack of disciplinary support from the administrators) the educrats has them performing under.
To all the anonymous commenters who believe teachers are overpaid, lazy, incompetent, cheats and what not, I extend a challenge:
You and I will go observe 3 teachers in different schools teach for a half-day.
Then those teachers and myself will come observe you in your workplace for a half-day.
I'll cover the cost of you missing work to observe teachers.
If your opinion about teachers doesn't change, then I will gladly write a Letter to the Editor stating your case and speak at the next CMS board meeting supporting your beliefs.
If your opinion does change about teachers, then you get to write a Letter to the Editor praising teachers and promise to speak at the next CMS board meeting supporting teacher raises.
Actions speak louder than words, here's your chance to prove your point once and for all.
Jeff
I've never accused teachers of being lazy, and I do not support them receiving raises "that require an increase in my taxes".
Jeff, tell me if I am wrong here.
First, in the suburban schools, you will find teachers having to deal with overcrowded classes to the extent they can not gie help to individual students. They will deal with lack of desks, space, books and other resources that downtown has "strangled" them for over the years.
Second, in the urban schools, while there are many kids wanting to be good students, they deal with kids coming too far behind developmently (age wise) than they should be. Kids without necessary sleep, feeding, and basic care, bordering on or even crossing the line of neglect/abuse. Kids come to class without supplies. Kids come to class not prepared for the class and not even academically qualified to be at that level. And lastly, kids come to school who have no idea how to behave, respect other students and teachers and a total lack of discipline from behavior to concetrating in class.
Let me know. But to qualify myself, I typically stand behind the teachers. Yes there may be a few not so good ones but that is more likely due to inept adminstrators and downtown demi-gods.
Has the "bang for the buck" report been released? Will it be published in the paper?
5:55, it will be part of the school progress reports that CMS will post Monday. Those reports have a whole lot of interesting data about each school. I've asked for all that data in a list that can be sorted, so I (and readers) don't have to click each school's report to make comparisons and get the big picture. When I get that data I'll get it posted.
CMS employees could use a raise much like the rest of us who are still working. But to suggest the raise should be decided by a vote of the County Board is a prime example of CMS leadership failing to lead. The County Board does not generally line item the CMS budget, high paid CMS leadership does. Look at the $85,000 to $120,000 salary range and compare to private sector salaries in Mecklenburg County. CMS management is well paid considering the layers of bureaucracy doing their work for them. If CMS leadership wants CMS staff to receive a pay increase they know how to budget the increase. Intentionally turning a pay increase into a political volleyball between the two boards is a cheap attempt to divert responsibility away from CMS and on to the County Board.
How is Latarzan Henry doing with the party planning? Havent seen her name in the media lately. Has she reached the $25 million price point yet? How about Cobitz and Baxter and the other PR flunkies? Have they spent their millions on useless testing data that they cant give a straight explanation to yet? SO much waste that can be achieved with out the County Board. Where and when will adequate leadership finally appear?
New Flash...Everyone working wants a raise. If you don't like the pay you have, then apply for another job that pays more no one is forcing to work where you work - and no employer owes you anything except for what you agreed to work for.
CMS has also taken away the dental and vision benefits for an individual employee. Benefits have VALUE. This is another loss of around $2,000. You can have health insurance, but now it is on a 70/30 plan. Combine these loss of benefits in any calculations. Combine the rate of inflation into the mix and I am down $6,000 in salary and benefits. This on top of teaching now about TWICE as many students. This overall effect takes a toll on even the most dedicated educator.
Anon 6:01.....
My company doesn't offer any vision care and our dental is a three year tier plan that covers pretty much just the basics.
...the times they are a changin'....
Anonymous 5:41p, January 12 -
I don't see much wrong with what you're writing there. I think most of those situations happen in various schools.
And I won't dispute that there are low quality teachers in CMS. But on the whole, I believe the majority of teachers are good to great.
My challenge - which no one seems to want to bite on - is simply to show that teachers are getting a bad rap these past few years. I want to combat that perception.
Jeff
How about the Charlotte Observer digging deeper as to why CMS is asking for teacher raises...it's not because of test scores or because it wants to reward teachers. CMS is very worried!
There is a confidential report that shows the voluntary attrition rate at CMS in the last year is sky-high -- 2000 certified staff have left.
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